Meeting transcript
Planning and Zoning Commission Regular Meeting
March 20, 2023 · Watch on YouTube · All meetings
Jed, can I just ask you really quick? I have a document that, Jim wants to put up, when it's time to show everybody. Yep. How do I I saved it as a download, how do I, bring it up as a document for you guys to see for the board on the whiteboard? You
should have it minimized on your screen. Okay. And then if you click on the share screen, you should see all the documents that you have up. And you click on the one you want, and then I think it starts sharing, and we should be able to All get right. Thanks.
Well, have 07:00, and so I will call the regular planning and zoning meeting to order. And first up on the agenda is roll call and seating of alternates. And I see Anne Ferme is here. I see Steve Nelson is here. Leanne, is that you with the phone number I don't recognize? Maybe not. Okay. Yes, I am here. Oh, okay.
So that's Leanne. And I did talk with Scott Persson earlier today. I know he was expecting to make it tonight, but I don't see him yet. So at this point, I will seat Susan England for Scott Persson until he shows up. And I am here. So, that's our commission for tonight. Under item three, additions and changes to the agenda, I would like to add one item to just briefly talk under new business item C, upcoming regulation changes. And does anybody else have anything that they need to add or change from the agenda? Hearing none, I will make a motion to add upcoming regulation changes as new business item C to the agenda. Looking for a second. I'll second that. I'll second it. Thank you, Steve. Any other discussion? Hearing none, I'll call for a vote. Anne? Aye. Steve? Aye. Lee Ann? Didn't hear you, Leigh Ann, and I can't see you. Is she on mute? It does not look like she's on mute.
Can you hear me now? I can, yep. Okay, yeah, aye. Okay, thank you.
Susan? Aye. And I vote aye as well, the motion carries five-zero-zero. Any public comment before we start this evening? Anybody who wants to address any issues that are not on the agenda this evening? Hearing none, we'll go to new business. And the first new business is 5B, receipt of application for special permit for an accessory apartment at 43 Aspinall Drive. Jim, do you want to start us off on that?
Sure. This application came in. I have not reviewed it. I only got the site plan and the architecturals, I believe, today. But it does seem to be complete and does require public hearing. We're talking about a standalone accessory apartment at the end of Aspinall in an existing garage. And I believe well, I was under the impression either the owner or contractor would be on this evening.
I'm on it, and my thing says Lulu, but I don't know why. My name is Robert Di Adamo. I am the homeowner at 43 Aspinall Drive. Good evening, everyone.
Good evening. Good evening. And my name is Nick Lulik. My company is Woodcraft Designs. I'm the contractor on that project.
Okay, thank you, Nick. So, my brain slipped it already. I think you said Robert?
Yes, sir. Okay, yep. I focus on Lulu and Robert goes right out. Yeah, and my wife put that in as an old pet name, I believe.
Okay, yep, there you go. Do you want to tell us about your application?
Or would you like Nick to run through that? Well, Nick, on the professional level is what you folks would like. I think it'd be better if he spoke. Know what we want, but he knows what we need. Okay, very good. No problem. This is a
detached, one car garage as it stands now, and we would, like to turn it into a efficiency apartment, with a full kitchen, a full bathroom, a bedroom, a common area. It will end up being two seventy six square feet. We plan on, hooking into the the main house for hot and cold water, as well as use the, existing septic, design in the basement of the house. We'd like to break through that, foundation wall and hook up into the basement to discharge, you know, the septic waste. It's going to be, vinyl sided. We're gonna put a new roof on it. We're gonna add some windows to bring it up to code. It'll be complete with heat and
Nick, hold on just a minute. Do you happen to have a drawing of the building that you could share with us or if not, I can have Jim bring Hold it it up.
Nope, if you could. I didn't know if you had an electronic copy that we could see there or not. I
ended up emailing it to the, you know, the building department. I actually it was last week along with the site plan. Jim was away at the time, but, I did confirm that he did receive it. Yep. Nicholas,
may I ask? Could you just email it to me? Sure. And I'll It just put it is posted. Oh, it is posted? Okay. Let me let me. I'm gonna see if Okay.
Can everybody see my screen there? Mhmm. Yes, sir. Mhmm. Okay. There we go. Oh, that Yep.
Those are the four elevations, and it looks like a partial of the, some of it got cut off. But to the far left is, just a continuation of the the full bathroom in the bedroom. But it's fairly complete. What you're looking at now. Now the building is 12 by 20. We're going to add a six by six mudroom as an entrance, which would bring it to a total of two seventy six square feet.
Okay. When you say 12 by 20, I looked at it and I saw 11 by 19.
Let's see. Okay. He's using the interior. What is the interior design? What is the exterior? Right. The the outside Dimensions.
Dimensions are 20 by 12. Okay. What you're seeing is is minus the thickness of the walls. Yep, I got it. Okay. I did meet with Nick a few weeks back on a preliminary design, and it was modified to address a couple of concerns, one of them being the minimum size requirement. As far as the septic, it has been referred to Northeast or I'm sorry, Eastern Highlands Health District. I don't have a response of yet. I don't know whether he's looking for additional information or not. Nick, were you able did you provide him with some
sort of a connection diagram? I did not provide him with the connection diagram, but I talked to him in detail about my intentions and he was okay with it at the time. Was like this was probably three weeks ago, maybe more. And his name escapes me, but he. Yes, he did say that at this time he was, he didn't need anything further. So I'm sure he's gonna want a copy of the site plan showing the connection at some point, but I have not heard from him since. Thank you.
Okay. So, yep, I saw this drawing for the first time today and there's the, what it looks like from the outside. Correct.
Yep, what the current garage looks like I did not take a ride out there to take a look at it. Yeah, the gable faces the road and it's got the the large entry door to bring your car.
Obviously that will be taken out. There is a window, that is cut off to the left that's existing. We'd like to keep that. And then the other windows would, be egress windows.
Okay. And then I'm going to try and get into the a two survey. And so questions that I had on here is I did not see where the septic system was and I know you've got to get Thad King's approval on that But it would be nice to see that in there. And then the other thing I was looking for right off the top of my head was the adequacy of parking. You know, our regulations require three parking spots, two for the main home and then one for the accessory apartment. And I don't know if those fit there on the concrete slab or not, but if you could just show us that those will
fit in there somehow that you've taken care of that, I'd appreciate it. Yep, there's the concrete pad is existing and you can see it there on the print, to the left of that is also additional parking. So we can we can add those parking spaces so that Okay, that you have a clear view. Very good.
So, Nick, did you have anything else you wanted to add about the accessory apartment?
No, I think I've, you know, explained it clearly, but if you anyone has any questions, be happy to answer them.
I do have one comment. You know, we all hear about these tiny homes, and this is one right before you. And what was interesting to me is how how difficult it is to lay one out. What we take for granted in a in a house, like sliding doors, is almost prohibitive in a little tiny house. Challenge to to to meet all the requirements in that in in 266 square feet. Long.
Well, and I know that, you know, we're going to be trying to eliminate that minimum square footage, but I don't think you can eliminate too many square footage and get everything that you've got in that one. You got it tucked in there about as tight as it can be. I agree. I have a very minimalistic daughter.
Okay, yep. So I did see that Scott Persson has now joined us as has as did Kevin Artisan. So Scott, at this point, we'll seat you in place of Susan England. As long as you're really there, Scott. Yeah, I'm here. Okay, very good. Yep. So at 07:14, we'll seat Scott Persson. One more time, any other questions on the application that we've seen here?
What's this construction of the building? It doesn't show, that a two by six, two by four, what kind of installation? Is it going to be the same installation that's required on a home? We're
going to bring it right up to code, whatever it takes. So if we need to do, sometimes, it's a two by four, but it's actually the old fashioned, you know, the two by fours now are inch and a half by three and a half inches. This is actually two inches by four inches. I believe the exterior our value that's needed is our 25. So we're probably going to use some spray insulation. To bring it up to code. The ceiling insulation will be our 49. There's plenty of room for that. And then we're going to insulate the floor as well. Right now it's a slab slab on grade frost wall foundation. So we're gonna, we've got enough headroom so we can, put a floor down. So I'm going to use pressure treated,
most likely two by eights or two by tens with a three quarter inch sub floor. And then we're going to insulate that floor so that it meets, today's, building codes. And what size is that slab?
That is unknown to me. It's an existing building. I have no way of knowing.
Where is it? Is there a connection to the septic system?
Not as of yet, but we will be connecting. I did have a conversation with. The sanitarian or the the the Highland District. The person that's in charge in I explained to him I'd like to break through the wall, underground and then hook up into the existing home. He said that was permitted. And that's how we'll get our hot and cold water as well. Hot and cold water coming from where? From the existing home.
What about the electrical? Are you gonna tap off the existing home for the electrical and put a sub panel in? Yep, exactly. Right now it's overhead.
I'm not sure how we're gonna handle that. Either we're gonna go overhead from the main house over or we're gonna go underground with a sub panel. Okay.
But is it a 100 amp service today in the house or 200? It's a I believe it's a 100 amp. Okay. And you have enough space to get a subpanel? Yep. There's enough. K. Yep. Should be good.
There's enough there's enough available amperage in the in that 100 amp panel to supply another apartment?
According to my electrician, yes. But if we need to upgrade it, we'll we'll do whatever it takes to to bring it up to speed.
I wonder how many amps he's gonna bring out to that accessory apartment.
And we haven't gotten that far yet, but, he has, looked at it. We've talked about it, and he doesn't seem seem to have a problem with it. So, you know, whatever it takes, we'll we'll get there.
This is why he is answering these questions, not me.
Well, all that stuff has to be on the print, isn't it Jed? All the cotton cold, where the septic is, if the septic meets the code, if it's gonna be able to beat a new accessory apartment, know, is there enough trenches in there?
Yeah, I had that conversation with the person that's in charge of that. And he did say that I was good. I didn't need to upgrade the tank. I didn't need to upgrade the fields. But we do have an as built on the septic in the file. I'm kind of surprised it wasn't shown on the site plan, but I'll definitely add it.
Before you joined us, we were talking about adding that, showing the parking spots required, and think that was in getting the approval from dad came for for the septic hookup.
Right. Is is how about a connection to the slab? How is that gonna be connected? I don't understand your question. You you have to connect new building to the slab.
Right? Right now, it's a it's a it's a frost wall. So there it's a four foot wall with a slab, and the sill plates are bolted to that top of the frost wall. That's already done? That is done. Yep.
So there's anchor anchor bolts coming through the sill plate with washers and nuts and. Oh, the slab was built for this accessory apartment.
I I don't know. I it's, you know, as it stands now, there's a frost wall there. I'm I'm assuming I I I, you know, I have no way of verifying other than it's sticking out of the ground. It's set up like a frost wall with a slab, a port slab. Yeah. You have the same phone number? It's come back next month anyways, isn't it, Chad? What was that, Scott? The application is going to come back next month?
It is. And as soon as we're done asking the questions here, we'll talk about scheduling of a public hearing for this and we'll go from there. Is it large enough?
It is large enough, you know, from the original drawing did not have, and I don't know if you were online, Scott, when we were showing the drawing of essentially the garage, but they added the 36 foot mudroom, which with the two forty square foot garage did exceed the minimum requirement that we've got there. That
was my concern is we didn't have enough square footage, but the mudroom saved the day. Any other questions? Will the mudroom be heated or not?
I I would say it probably will not be heated.
K. And that still qualifies as square footage versus the 200 bed?
I don't know that it is, Steve, because isn't the square footage at ceiling ceiling height, Jed? I I did not A finished ceiling, think. Finished ceiling height.
Yeah. There is it falls under the the gross definition of gross floor area. Okay. Again, I I have not reviewed this for conformity. I just reviewed the application to see if the components were here, assuming that I would do it prior to public hearing. I believe that the six by six bedroom brings it into compliance. Yes.
How we went over that, Jed? Finished ceiling height is how we determine the actual per footage.
Well, at least it is on the 2nd Floor of Holmes. I don't know. I guess I can go back and Yeah, it doesn't really show what the what the wall height is there.
Yeah, so I can add that as well. Finish ceiling height, but the finish ceiling height will be eight feet. Right now, from, the slab to the top plate, it's, over nine feet.
Okay, and I do think it's probably worth. I guess I was a little surprised by the comment it was not going to be heated. We think that we would have some kind of heating in there for whoever's living in there. The question was relative to the mudroom. Right, the building's
going to be heated. I got you. Okay. Yep. Yeah.
It's just the mudroom. We we were thinking we'd probably keep that cold bill you know, building on piers. Yep. That type of thing. Okay. What
is it gonna be heated with, Jeff? Do you know? I don't know. What's that? Probably does.
How's it going to be heated? Is that? Yep. Okay. Yeah, it's going be a ductless split. So, it's going to have AC and heat. So it's electric.
Yep. So I did see where I looked online to get the square footage and that sort of thing. I did see where the house has central air. So I guess if you could just verify, Nick, that the 100 amps is adequate for you know, bringing the electronic cooling in addition to the house. It does sound like 100 amps might be a little tight on that. Anyhow, that's probably not one of the things on our checklist, but we do expect this to be a little house, not a shed. Ductless split should also show on the elevation.
Yep. Okay. All right, no problem. Yeah, it's a hyper heat unit. It's a Mitsubishi brand. It's good for 20 below as far as heating and it comes with an additional AC program. It's it's it's a nice it's it's perfect for this size.
Okay, so those are just, yeah, those are some details there we'd like to see. The septic, electrical, heating unit, water to the accessory cooling unit.
Would you like to see a construction diagram where the heating is gonna be located? What are you gonna make it out of? I mean, how's the inspector gonna come in and inspect this?
It's gonna be open. You know, it's it's like new construction. So bare walls. He'll see the rough. He'll see the, the rough electrical, he'll see the rough plumbing just just as if we were building it from scratch. I've never seen a building built without a construction.
Well, building's existing, so it's it's already up. I mean, I can definitely add if if you'd like to see that. Not a problem at all. I'm just I didn't think it was necessary because it's it's built. Yeah. It's already up. Well, a garage exists.
The garage exists. It's an existing structure. Except for the mudroom.
So, don't well, we'll hold as a separate conversation, but, you know, when I looked at this, review it, I went through what our regulations require, assuming that the building official is going to get into all the other details for the building permit that goes on for this, then my intent was to verify it for our requirements.
Jed, I don't have the regs in front of me, but the minimum square footage, is that supposed to be living space in terms of, you know, it's supposed to be heated and cooled or that's what I'm where I'm getting hung up.
So, the regulation says the gross floor area of the accessory unit shall be between two fifty and eight hundred square feet and should be less than 33% of the gross floor area for the single family dwelling.
To me, that means it should be living space, right?
Well, when you talk about gross floor area as opposed to net floor area, And again, this is one of the things that we were talking about changing here. When I had the concern about, you know, the nine by 11, I looked on the GIS card for the property in the town list, the garage is two forty square feet. And so with the 36 foot mudroom that gives you up to two seventy six with the minimum being two fifty. Even you know, even if we were to use just the internal walls nine by 11 and that's that gives you a foot on each side, a half a foot thick wall.
You're 18 by 10. Say again, Scott? You're 18 by 10 then, right?
No. No. The in internal walls are 19 by 11. Living space? Yep.
But, again, the our definition currently, and we're looking to change that, is gross floor area of the accessory unit shall be between two fifty and eight hundred. So I consider that we've got that. It's how wide is the that, mudroom?
Well, it's six by six. Yeah. So that gives that adds 36 square feet.
19 times 11. That's it. Nine plus 37. Goats. Two forty five.
Yeah. 20 by 12. Again, we're we're going back to gross if you go to the definition of gross floor area in the zoning ranks, It's outside wall. And to the best of my knowledge, it does not address heat. It gets into basement height and ceiling heights of seven feet, and this and that and the other thing does not include height as far as I recall. Think conditioned space, Jim. And it has to do with ceiling height. What?
It has to do with ceiling height of conditioned space.
So if I go to the definition in section 24 of floor area gross, you know, there's a lot of stuff here, but to address the issue of height of ceiling, it talks about attic space if the floor has been laid over which there's a structural headroom of seven and a half feet or more. And so I am confident that this roof is going to come in at more than seven and a half. Nick can tell me if I'm wrong there. It
always talks about attics, which, again, is, It doesn't say anything about the height of the ceiling on the main floor. I guess it just assumes that that's going to be higher than seven and a half feet.
Well, it's dictated by new construction, by building code as well.
But it does say, you know, that under gross floor area, you know, it's the external measurement of the walls.
Yeah, I'm sorry. My wife and I worked this up and she took the inside dimensions, is throwing us off a little bit, but the outside dimensions of this building is 20 by 12. Yep.
I think that was, you know, I looked at this in the crisis in Connecticut with affordable housing. I was thinking that this was a good deal. And to achieve that goal. You know, there's some details on that, but I certainly looked through our regulations and I think we've hit on those areas that we need to have addressed before we get to our next meeting.
Yeah, I don't disagree that it's not a good plan, but I just wanted to understand whether the regs required the space, the square footage to be living space in terms of conditioned space.
It does not currently require that. It may in the future, but you know, under today's rules, does not. Okay, thank you. Okay, any other questions from anybody? And Scott, if you got more, we're happy to address them. We want to make sure we get a thorough review on what we're talking about here.
All the connections have to be on a print some Yeah. I will add those. No problem.
Something from the electrician saying that any modern house uses more than 100 amp service nowadays, I think. Yeah.
I'll revisit that with my electrician, and we'll do whatever it takes to be able to get this building up to speed. But I'll make a note of that and I'll show it on print.
Okay. Robert, an off the wall question for you. Are you planning on having a family member live in this? My daughter. Your daughter. So the reason I ask. Is you probably heard there's a lot going on about affordable housing these days. Yes, sir. And if you were to choose, and I don't have any bargaining power to offer you anything in return. Okay. If you wanted to have that deed restricted in rent for ten years, that would give the town an affordable housing unit. If it's not deed restricted, it doesn't count. So that's up to you. I've got nothing to enhance the pot for you one way or another. No, we're
just trying to, daughter, they lived in Plainfield, they sold their house, took advantage of the market. And she's always been wanting to be with us, my wife and I, and with the acreage we have here. We researched with the town prior to even going into a conceptual thought idea of doing this, which keeps family closer together. And, know, like I said, it's for everybody involved. Okay. Down the road when I'm, you know, moving on and what have you. I have my daughter here with her husband with my wife. I'm kind of looking at it in different angles.
Okay, no, I understand. And so that's my plug for the and if you were to say you agreed to that, then it would take a little research project for us to figure out how to do that because we don't know how to do a deed restriction anyhow. But I'd be happy to go learn if that opportunity provided itself to us. With that in mind, Nick and Robert, do you think you can have the extra details that we're looking for? Our next meeting comes up on April 17, a month away from now? Does that give you enough time to get everything done? Absolutely. No problem.
Okay. Yeah, if you don't mind me interjecting, that's where my next question was, because what we did was we refinanced our home to do this rental loan. And a rental loan has these time to start restrictions, time to end, which they just put in as stipulation types. But like the girl at the bank said, we don't really hold it. What if there was a hurricane? We can't hold you. I'm just gonna, I need to call them tomorrow and I'm gonna, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just gonna tell them, it looks like everything's moving ahead. There's a few more things we have to supply to get in for the April approval meeting. Is that pretty much the way I should explain it to the
mortgage company?
Well, we will, if you'll sit tight for a moment, we will make a motion to schedule a public hearing. If that gets approved then that's exactly the track that we'll be on. Thank you. So
at this point, I will make a motion to schedule a public hearing for the Accessory Unit 43 Aspinall Drive for April 17. Second. So moved.
Okay, Steve, I got you as the second on that. Any discussion? And Jim, can we get all our notifications made to support that being a month away?
Absolutely. I routinely provide a letter to the applicant and explain to them what they have to do, which is notify a butters, post a sign, etcetera. But I give you the particulars in a letter Okay. Shortly after this meeting. Very good. As soon as the public hearing is set.
Any other discussion on holding a public hearing at our April 17 meeting? Okay, hearing none, I'll call for a vote. Anne? Aye. Steve? Aye. Leigh Ann? Aye. Very well, thank you. Aye.
I vote aye as well. The motion passes five-zero-zero. So we'll hold a public hearing at the April 17 meeting. And if we have everything we need at that meeting, we would be able to act on that following the completion of the public hearing. Thank you. Any other questions for the Commission at this point, either Nick or Robert?
No, good. Thank you for everybody's contributing to helping us get this done.
Okay. Yeah, thank you. That's all we've got for you tonight then. Thank you very much. Thank you. Have a good evening. Next up is the new item 5C that I added, upcoming regulation changes. Okay. What is this that we're looking at? I didn't post it.
It seems to be the oh, this looks like the gravel pit.
Okay, we're not at gravel pit yet. Carol Ann, I see you talking, but you're muted. Yeah, Caroline, you're still muted. If we can close this out, we're not at the gravel pit yet. Okay. Sorry. Yep, not a problem. Let me Thank you.
Okay, so as I was getting ready for this meeting, one of the things that I was concerned about was the fact that the drawing that was posted in the folder did not meet the minimum square footage requirements. That's why the applicant added the 36 square feet for the mudroom. So I got myself working past and furious on accessory apartment changes that we had talked about some time ago to do that. I think there's probably a couple other accessory apartment applications that are in the conceptual stage that we haven't seen yet. So, I thought I would move ahead and try to get the accessory apartment changes through you guys and we would go there. Not a requirement for the application we just looked at, but certainly it is part of our affordable housing plan to make accessory apartments more convenient,
easy to get. And so I wanted to push those next, although it's not quite the crisis that I thought it would be with tonight's application. We also, I took, I probably spelled definitions wrong there. But I took out of what we approved for the municipal land uses and took the definition of frontage out there because it wasn't consistent with what we put the application in. But I'll add that at the same time, the frontage definition. And the two other things that we had come across that I wanted to change fairly soon was, you know, when we approved the kennel for Scott Beebe, there was some discussion, there's inconsistency in the wording and we used the out that we didn't need to hold a public hearing for a Class A kennel. I do think that we would like to hold a public hearing for a Class A kennel if it were in a place where the lots were more traditionally sized for the ARD. And so I want to change our requirements to make sure that we require a special permit and a public hearing for any kennel that we're put in. I think if somebody's living in an acre and a half or a one acre lot and they have a kennel right next to them, I know I wouldn't be too keen on that. So, I want to be able to make that be special permit kind of thing. The other thing that we came across was, you know, we had somebody that was looking to build a new construction home in a floodplain. And I want to eliminate that as well. I don't think
that the Commission thought that that was a smart thing to do. And so those are changes that by next meeting, will hope to have ready for you guys to review and then we'll head out from there. So I just wanted to pass that by you at this point. Any other changes that anybody thinks we need to make or any definitions? There were probably a couple other ones that we came across, but
Seems right off the bat, Ed, we have a problem with the floor area because it's it is conditioned space. I know it's conditioned space. What do you mean by conditioned space, Scott? Gotta be heated and doesn't have to be cool, but it has to be heated.
Yep, right. And yeah, we'll take a look. What we agreed to the last time we looked at the accessory apartment rules is putting the words in there from the state, I think, anyhow, I'll look at that with the fresh concerns that we came across tonight. That's why I thought tonight would be a good opportunity to look at another very small accessory apartment and see how that might change our proposed changes to that. So, I'll take a look at that and have something for you guys to look at next month when we get together. Sounds good. Okay,
I'm going to stop now and we will let Carol Ann put that thing back up and Jim can talk about the old business first item is the gravel pit. And yeah.
So I only got this drawing this evening and have not reviewed it. But it appears to show trade age. I anticipate getting a full size paper print tomorrow or the next day, which I will review. I've also spoken to the applicant, the owner, about completing the the haying and seeding, and he anticipates doing that in April, along with planting vegetation along the right side as you're standing from the road between Catherine Hutchinson's property on that hill for turtle habitat. Hank, original per plan, and Hank had also asked that the portion of the silt fence be removed to allow for turtle migration. I'm just going to verify that and reduce it to writing. And I'm hoping that work is done
well, basically getting to the end of April for the vegetation. Hope it should be done by then.
Was there any discussion, Jim, about bringing in additional topsoil for that back area?
I told him that was my concern and that we would be monitoring whether that takes seed or not. It would be difficult to topsoil that slope. I understand the slope. And
we did have something growing on it last year before they excavated all that material out of there. But certainly the flat area where you know it extended back quite a bit beyond where he's got the hay and the seed now.
Right, so in front of the hill seemed awful Sandy. Yes.
I don't know if there's topsoil on that hill in Glastonbury at the corner of 83 And 94 that they're taken out but they're removing a heck of a mountain out of Glastonbury to make affordable housing development there. It's incredible the amount of material they're moving. So it would probably get dirt cheap right now.
That's all gravel and rock and gravel over there. Okay, yeah,
figured it probably wasn't all topsoil. Okay, Jim, I think we'll give you a chance to review the drawing and give us a follow-up brief at the next meeting. Okay. That sound good? Yes, thank you. Okay. Jim or Jed? Yes. Yes, Leah. Is
it possible it sounds like I think you said you spoke directly with the with the owner I did. To
get this type of thing in somewhat earlier so that you and then we can see it a little sooner? Sure. Thank you. I mean, I can post this tomorrow. Okay. Good. Thank you. You're welcome.
Okay, Carol Ann, if you close that out then. Any other comments on the gravel pit before we go on to the next item? Okay, next item is plan of conservation and development discussion regarding future meeting dates and locations. So, we have continued to work towards getting, Taiki, the company is involved in updating our plan of conservation and development in addition to having John from Taiki be our town planner. Right this minute, there's money in the town budget to support a town planner to a limited extent, certainly not a full time thing, but we're looking at eight hours a week. And his primary job to start would be working on the plan of conservation and development. But as we were talking to the fellow, problem that comes up is he's got a couple other towns that he's working for, and his Monday nights are already fairly busy. And so I was thinking, you know, might it be possible for us to move the planning and zoning meetings to a Tuesday night? What kind of, you know, problems does that create for anybody? And we don't need an answer tonight. All I can tell you is that our choice of, who we might want to have for a town planner,
his Mondays are pretty much all full and would be looking for a different day there. If I had my pick, you know, I would, most convenient for me is the third Tuesday of the month. I've got other meetings right now on the second and the fourth Tuesday, so
the third would be good. Tuesdays would also be better for me, Jed.
Tuesday better for Yeah. You, Okay. I see Anne shaking her head. That's fine. Yep. Steve, how's that work for your schedule? I think that'll work. Kate Leanne?
Yes, I think that would work for me also. Okay, super. That
was easier than I hoped. I was hoping that we wouldn't finally get money in the budget, get a guy that we wanted to work with, and then we couldn't arrange to have a meeting there. So I'll plan on, at some point, probably after July, shift our meetings to Tuesday. But that's and that would be the reason. So thank you very much for supporting on that. Kevin and Susan, did you have any thoughts on that? Can those work for you? I'm pretty flexible. Yeah. Okay. Thank Tuesday you, is good for me. Okay.
That sounds like a win all the way around then. Thank you. That's really all I had on the Planet Conservation Development update. Any questions on that topic or where we stand on the town planner? But I'm encouraged that we might actually be able to make some progress on getting the town planner working on that. And if it wasn't planning conservation and development, I'd like to have them working on actually getting us started on the affordable housing project because that's a big deal. Okay, hearing none, I'm going to go on to training requirements. We're going to go. Okay, so again, this is out of the Public Act 2129. And I just wanted to put out on here, we've talked about the training requirements a little bit, But anybody who's on the Commission, you know, after January 1 shall complete at least four hours of training. And that'll be every other year thereafter. Training content must contain at least one hour on affordable and fair housing policies. May include process and procedure. It shows a bunch of stuff there. And the training guidelines must be established by OPM prior to oneonetwenty twenty two. I don't think they met that date. And it says training may be provided by various entities and a bunch of things listed down there. The two of most interest there are the Connecticut or the Land Use Academy of Yukon, which is CLEAR, and then the Connecticut Bar Association. So did anybody get anything from the Connecticut Bar Association following that training, little diploma or anything? I didn't get anything either. Yep, I didn't get anything either. And last
time I attended, they asked for feedback on it. Maybe that was because that was the first time they did it on Zoom. But one of the guys who, the guy who was talking on fair housing right after we had the half hour on affordable housing said, Gee whiz, you guys have just sat through a half hour on affordable housing and a half hour on fair housing. That sounds like an hour to me. I know Mark Branch had said that, you know, we only had a half hour in the presentation and you had to do something else. But this guy said during the training that he thought it met the conditions and I think it does too. So if you attended the Connecticut Bar Association training, I assume that you have met the training requirements. If you send me an email saying you attended, I'll put that in my little file and you are done with land use training for the next two years. Now, I know Ann Cremay was there. Jim, you attended? Yes.
Okay. And you've got some special requirements in that public act that I did not put up here because they only apply to you. Are you in good shape with respect to all that stuff? I believe so, yes. Okay. Scott, you attended? Yes.
And Leigh Ann, did you attend? Didn't hear anything from Leigh Ann. Kevin, were you able to attend? No, I wasn't. Okay.
And so, the next I was say again? Yeah, this is Leanne. Yes, I attended the whole day. Okay, yep. Good. So we're off to a good start there. I know that the Bar Association recorded the training session. And so I think there's really two ways that you can accomplish the training thing. You can sit through the stuff on the Connecticut Bar Association at least up through the fair housing portion. I think there was a couple of things on inland wetlands after that. They were good. If you wanted to get that, you can. I have not looked online to see where it's at, but I'll get something, you know, even if I have to email Mark Branch to get ahold of that. But I did not see anything talking about where to go watch it. The other thing is those three clear sessions that I sent the link out to everybody before, did have, you know, they were three sessions, an hour and a half each. That seemed to fit the requirements for everything, and that could do it too. So I know you can link into those. Either way is good. But it makes sense to me since, you know, I didn't ask any questions during the thing. If you were to watch the video, I think that's certainly good to go and I don't see another a lot of other opportunities to meet the training requirement with that. So,
Kevin, if you could try and meet one of those two wickets by the end of the year, I would appreciate that. Okay.
And then, so if we go to the next slide, must report compliance annually to the legislative body or the Board of Selection, Board of Selectmen in the town meeting towns, which is us. So, you know, as part of my annual report next year, well, probably not for this because we'll go to the end of the year here, but I would ask that you do the sexual harassment training by the end of June, everybody, and let me know when you're done with that so that I can put in my annual report that we've done that. And then I will write a note to the Board of Selectmen at the end of the year saying where we stand on getting the land use training done. So that's all I wanted to say about that. But I know Susan England told me that she watched the Connecticut Bar Association training and the CLEAR training. So she's, you know, and I did the same. So we went above and beyond the call of duty to meet the training requirements, but it sounds like we're in pretty good shape on that. So that's good news too. Thank you. I know some of those lectures, oh I didn't ping on Steve. No, I have not completed it. Yeah, I know you've been busier than on our paper hanger and so
I'll get it in before the end of the year though. Very good. Appreciate that Steve. Thank you.
Anybody else I didn't harass on training here tonight that's, think we got everybody. I'll catch up with Anne Blanchard at some point here and find out where she stands. Approve the next item up is approval of the minutes. And the first item is the public hearing from 01/23/2023. In his advertisements, those minutes were hard to prepare, hard to get through. Carol Ann, Jim and I sat and went through them a little bit and what I said, I think, again today, you should have already had that earlier, was a revised set of meeting minutes. And so I'll make a motion to approve the public hearing meeting minutes from January 23. I second that. Thank you, Anne. Any discussion on the public hearing minutes? And I have none that might have already been incorporated. Okay. Hearing none, a call for a vote. Anne? Aye.
Steve? Aye. Leigh Ann? I'll come back to you, Leigh Ann, in a moment. Scott? Aye. Can I vote aye? Leigh Ann, if you are still there, I did not hear your vote. Okay, so I'm going to treat Leanne as an abstention at this point. And the motion carried four-zero-one with Leanne abstaining for technical reasons most likely, but leave that as a bay. Next item up are the regular meeting minutes from January 23. And I'll make a motion to approve the regular meeting minutes of January 23, Planning and Zoning Commission. I second it. Thank you, Anne. Any discussion on those? Hearing none, I'll call for a vote. Anne? Aye.
Steve? Aye. Leigh Ann? Scott? Aye. And I vote aye as well. The motion passes four-zero-one with Lee Ann abstaining. Moving on to the special meeting held February 16. I'll make a motion to approve the special meeting minutes from February 16, Planning and Zoning Commission. Second. Thank you, Anne. Any discussion? Hearing none, Anne? Anne: Aye. Steve? Dad, I wasn't there, so I'll abstain. Okay.
Leigh Ann? Scott? Aye. And I vote aye as well. The motion passes three-zero-two with Steve Nelson and Lee Ann abstaining.
I'm back now. Yes, I also was absent, so I would be abstaining anyway. Okay.
Did you want to cast an aye vote either in support of or opposition to the January 23 public hearing or regular meeting minutes? And I can leave you Well, Well You can what? I can leave you as we put you down as abstaining because I didn't hear from you. I can go back and revise that if you want to devote aye or nay.
Or we can leave you I as a had a question. Was looking for it while I was trying to unmute myself. Okay. On the regular meeting minutes. Yep. Under number six, old business. About two thirds of the way through, it's number six a. I guess it's only thing under item six. Yep. It says Jim Halsey, etcetera. The sentence that begins, it's well within, well outside the wetlands review area. Alright. Well, outside approximately 195 feet currently. So, it sounds like Carol Ann was, you know, taking it right from the tape. So, I was just wondering for clarification where it says it's well within, well outside. Do you see what I mean? I do see what you mean.
And certainly the intent of the discussion, I might be speaking for Jim here, but he can correct me if I'm wrong. I remember him saying that we were well outside of the Upland Review area. Okay, so if we can just add that correction.
So the correction would be to remove the words well within. So it reads, it's well outside the wetland review area. All right, well outside approximately 195 feet currently.
Actually, I think it's out. It would have been outside the approved plan, not the Upland review. That the upland review area.
What do you mean by well outside the approved plan?
You've proved plan from wetlands was something like 95 feet from. Oh, it's wetlands. Yes. So it was the wetlands plan. Because the one ninety five and one ninety six as I recall, I mean, that's a 200 foot upland review area in that area. Along the river? Yeah.
Okay. So are you saying that they have their own plan and it's outside the approved plan belonging to wetlands, not us?
Well, it was the same plan. I I I realize It was the same plan, but.
But the wetlands the Wetlands Commission authorized the material removal.
Okay. So I guess I'm just a little confused about the difference between saying it's well outside the wetlands review area and the wetlands plan, which you're saying is the same plan that we would have had. So you're saying it's what kind of the same thing saying it's I well outside the wetlands review
don't know what I said, but what I I believe I meant was the approved plan. And that approved plan was a plan that was approved by both commissions. Okay. But the statement isn't inaccurate, isn't it? Don't understand what you just said, Scott.
Oh, that you're saying that there's a 200 foot buffer for the along the river, which I know there is. That's the grading was ok'd up to 195, so that's within the 200. It's not out of the buffer, it's in the buffer.
I agree. Saying that the facility was further away than the approved plan had been shown and approved.
All I know is we wrestling with removal of material from that hill. We sent it over to wetlands agent to review it, and he said it's not a problem. So I figured, you know, it must be outside the wetlands review area, and I don't have the photo in front of me right now.
So, I guess we're not really in agreement right now, right? Hold on just a minute. Let me see.
Jed, that okay would have to come from the wetlands board. Right?
Not if it was we have given the wetlands agent authorization to adjudicate matters inside the Upland Review area.
Right. Exactly. He can do that. You and you have given him that. Yep. But that's the only zoning enforcement guy, isn't it? Well, that's the the wetlands enforcement. Alright. Alright. So you gave him that permission?
We did. The commission authorized him to adjudicate applications inside the Upland Review area. Okay.
So I guess I'm still not clear if if this is considered inside or outside.
Yep. I'm trying to get I'm trying to find a picture that we can put up and look at exactly what we're saying. So here, this line here is 200 feet from the Hop River. And what we did is we excavated a bunch of stuff out of here and we never went back to that 200 feet buffer zone. It was all in this area here. So that's do you agree with that, Jim? When was this print made?
This print that we're looking at here is from August, I'd have to close it 08/15/2022, last August.
Right, so they just finished that grading two weeks ago. Yep, I gotcha.
But all they did was they smoothed out the big excavation cavity that they put in there. All right. If
you look at the 200 foot line going back here, that is way back towards the end of the hill, you know, up over the top. And so while they got close to the top, it wasn't at the upper elevation. And that shows me that it's all outside of the Upland review area.
But did they fill that area in, Chad? Is that what you're saying?
They just I think they just plowed the edges smooth. Was a big excavation right in here that was all done and they just leveled it. It
staked out an area over the right, on the right side, not to go beyond. And they did not.
Well, did anybody check that the 200 is still there?
The wetlands agent took a look at it and said it was fine. Oh, good. Measured it? Don't know how he came to that question. All
I know is, you know, when we were discussing way ahead with Mark Branch here, the wetlands agent concluded there was no wetlands violation.
Where it says 200 foot 200 feet to water course, it's that line?
Yep. So right here, it says 200 feet to water course, and that goes from the Hop River to this line right here. And then, you know, it comes back down because of this brook over this way.
Well, Jed, the only reason I'm asking you is because I I don't know where the 200 foot line is. That's you know? Is it there? I'm not saying they didn't change that. Somebody needs to check it. Yep.
I did not check it. I did look at what they were doing in comparison to the picture here, and I thought what they did was reasonable.
Right. They knocked the edge down to fill in They that
did. Yep. That's exactly what they did. And that's what I was expecting them to do. So I guess going back to the sentence that Leanne questioned. And I think the best we can do is, you know, stay with crossing out the words well within. It's well outside the wetlands review area. And Jim, maybe the best thing to do is put a period there. 195 feet only clouds the issue up because 195 feet is on the wrong side of the line. And I don't think that's where they were at.
This is Leanne. I can't see. I'm not actually in the the actual Zoom portion. I mean, I can't see what you're what you have found and posted. So if Scott, do you understand the clarification?
I I do understand it, Lee Ann, but nobody's gone out there and checked it. If they knocked that edge off, you don't know where that 200 feet is. That's my point.
Knock the edge off. You don't It was a stake in the ground. We went out. It was out. Both Joe and I verified it. Both Joe and I saw it.
I know what you did. Anybody measure to the river? I did not.
Again, if you look at where this line, you know, going up here on my cursor, and I know you can't see it, Leanne, this is way at the backside of the hill. And so when we were talking about, you know, moving the material, we were talking about keeping them over on the left hand side of this because that's where we got the most room to negotiate. But even here, you know, it's it's a it. They never never touched it, Jed? That corner, that side?
The right hand side? Yeah. I don't think so. You know, I don't think it's where they leveled it off wasn't too far in front of this, but it certainly wasn't back behind it. I don't know.
So can we leave it that we'll make this change to the way the minutes are worded? And then can we leave it that Jim or the wetlands agent will measure it between now and the next meeting?
Well, I think at this point, the minutes are approved. Might have an error in it, but they are approved at this point. And that doesn't mean that Jim can't go verify, you know, how far the crest of the hill is from the river there. But I thought, you know, all things considered, I got what I was expecting to get, which was more than I thought when we started this out. I thought we're in better shape than I was given as credit to be able to get to. But Jim, I would ask you to go, you know, just check to see how far the crest of what they've got there is from the river.
I know you and Joe went out there and checked that out when we were fussing about them having the excavation cut in that.
Yeah, we're going back, I mean, we're going back a little bit. And we played around with that concern about the angle of repose on that slope. Yep. And eventually, and they didn't seem to get it right for a while. And eventually, we were happy with it.
But Jim, you were out there with both Hank and Joe, and you were both, all three were with what was going on the exception of a couple of comments that Hank made that they're addressing. Yes. Okay, well then, thank you.
So, Leanne, we're going to cross the words, Carol Anne, well within we'll make that correction to the minutes. And Leigh Ann, did you want to vote one way or the other on that?
Abstaining, I vote aye. So Yes, thank you for the opportunity to come back.
So those minutes are approved, five-zero-zero. And the same thing, Leigh Ann, with the public hearing minutes? You have any Okay. So, the public hearing minutes are approved five-zero-zero as well. Okay, thank you, Leanne. You're welcome. I
can't remember where we got to. We're done with the special meeting. Now up to February 27. February 27 regular meeting minutes. I move that the regular meeting minutes from February 27, the Plains Zoning Commission be approved. And don't stop now. I'll second it. Oh, thank you, Anne. Okay. Did we have anybody have any comments on the minutes? I do. Sorry, I'm trying to find it. Okay.
Take your time. While we're waiting for Leanne, Jim, I asked you to take a look at the enforcement actions update versus what you had said just to make sure that all those were what you had said.
Yes. The exception. There's a couple that are that are not filled in. Let's see. Give me a second.
Okay. While you're waiting, I'll start with a couple of my own comments. Does anybody else have any comments on there?
I just had two at the very beginning. This is Leanne. Yep. Go ahead, Leanne. One was, actually, they're both under the same item. Under others present Yep. I
believe my mother, Katherine Hutchinson, was present in the audience for the whole meeting. I agree with you.
And then if we could just add Hank's last name as Gruner. Yep. That's it. Thanks. Okay.
And on that same paragraph, I did not think that Eric Anderson attended the last meeting. And I went back trying to sort that out with the video today, and I couldn't tell one way or another. But the fact that he didn't comment makes me think he probably wasn't there. So if we can eliminate Eric, add Hank Gruner's last name and add Katherine Hutchinson, that would do that. The other thing we need to state, Carol Ann, is that we had Kevin and Anne Blanchard both seated as commission members due to the absences. Okay.
And then I'm okay with the enforcement actions as written in the minutes. Say again, Jim. I'm okay with the enforcement actions Okay. Reported in the minutes.
Under the first little paragraph under the zoning agent enforcement actions thing, it says an application has been received for an accessory apartment on Drive at the top of March 2023.
That's what Jim said. So, you know, he didn't have any other information to provide at that time. That's what he only that's all he offered to add. Okay. Okay. Now maybe see for now. Aspinall Drive.
Period. Aspenol Drive, period. We don't need the information on the date. It actually gets received as of the date of tonight's meeting. Okay. Yeah, that's fine. That reflects transpired, yes. Yep.
Then the next I don't know what that reflects what I should have said if that's not what I said. For purposes of these minutes, think that would be fine.
Okay. And the following sentence there should be, it is expected that a public hearing will be slated for April 2023. Jim doesn't get to schedule those. Okay. Thank you. So, going let that slide.
Any other comments on the minutes from February 27? Okay, so we're voting on the minutes as amended. Anne? Aye. Steve? I'll abstain because I wasn't there. Okay. Leigh Ann? Aye. Scott? Aye.
And I vote aye as well. Motion passes four-zero-one with Steve Nelson abstaining. And again, it's not a requirement that you abstain if you weren't at the meeting. It's just a question of whether or not you watched any of the meeting and that sort of thing. And that's your personal feelings on whether or not you can vote to approve them or not and have to abstain. So that's that. Lost my agenda here. What's up next on the agenda, Jim? I know we're getting close to the end here. I believe it's zoning agent report. Yep, okay.
Okay. And Carol Ann, I will send you a copy of this matrix. I know I said I would. I will send it out tomorrow. Thank you. Okay. Property at 43 Times Farm Road, owner Philip Byron. RV used for human habitation. I have received well, the gentleman that's living in the trailer stopped by, told me he'd be out of there early April. And I have left message. I have spoken to the gentleman who is the administrator of the estate or the conservator of the estate. And he has been tried. He tried to get ahold of me and I'm under the impression that he will be following following up with a written comment. Did not actually hear him say that he would take care of it. He said he would speak to the gentleman living in it and he apparently did.
So hopefully that will be resolved soon. 87 Merrick Valley, I have a ongoing operating landscaping business. I've sent a few letters and I did get one response and I provided a follow-up, some directions to them. I have not heard from them, but I will follow-up on that. 64 Long Hill Road is a long standing debris complaint. Did hear from the owner, one of the owners, did And get a schedule, a written schedule for cleanup. I did issue actually a cease and desist, or I'm sorry, a notice under the blight violation. And then I was told by the town attorney to follow-up with a second notice, which actually put the appeal period in there, which I did. It is now accruing fines. And hopefully that will be taken care of. And hopefully the fines will drive the speed of that. But he gave me a cleanup period of some time in April, and I was hoping for something quicker than that. But I will be in contact with him again. 349 Route 6, Thomas And Linda Mills. This is the Delapaletti fence. I've been working with him for some time. Again, I have a written memo from him indicating he's purchased the material. He is painting the fence, and hopefully it will be up in April repaired. And last but not least, have property at 664 Route 6, Property at Steve Barnett. Had a lot going on there. Started out as a lot of junk accumulating. I was trying to work with the owner. His progress has not been too quick. A blight violation was sent out. Clock is ticking. I intend to follow-up with
a zoning violation for the junk under, I'm calling it a junk business. And I have spoken to Mark Brantz and I have put together a memo that hopefully will get out tomorrow, him on that. In addition, there is an RV behind the house. There's a single family dwelling on the property. And behind that single family dwelling is an RV with people residing in it. And I had sent out a cease and desist. And I was led to believe that that had been vacated. And I think it was for a short period of time. Folks have moved back in. Again, I'm working with both the owner of the property, Steve Barnett and Mark Branch, to see what we can do and try and find alternative housing for them as well. In addition, not exactly a zoning violation, but there's been a health district order on the single family dwelling that it's no longer habitable and trying to provide some assistance to the gentleman living in there. And it's been very time consuming. It's a difficult process. The health code, the fact that the town gets involved in a code violation action that displaces somebody triggers real connected relocation act. And we're working through that with a number of parties, including the town attorney and our social service person.
But it's it's rather a challenge. That's that's what I have. Any questions? Be happy to answer.
Okay, moving on to the Inland Wetlands Water Corps Commission liaison. I have nothing to report. Next up, item 11, public comment. I don't think anybody's left to public comment. So That's that. Next regular meeting, April 17. I did check the calendar, Anne, so we know we got the right date for the right day on that one. And we are planning to hold that meeting live in the community room. We're going to give that a try. I'm not going to try doing a hybrid meeting first. I just want to get a regular meeting back in the community room. We'll see how that goes and based on that, we'll see if we can do a hybrid to get other people
in. Any questions or comments about the fact that we're going to meet in person? And after we try it, we'll see whether we like that better than what we're doing now or not. Plan accordingly. But it'd be nice for the summer months to actually get together in person there.
Next up? This is Leanne. I like the idea of a hybrid meeting in the future, if that can be facilitated after we have this in person meeting.
Yep. Since all I have is a desktop computer that I feel comfortable using, I'm not sure what I'm gonna use it. I have to get the, figure out how I'm going to share screen, do all that stuff from town hall on a computer that's not and that, maybe that'll be very easy, I don't know. But I'm not going to go for the hybrid and demonstrate my inability to do all that technical stuff to any wider audience than I have to. Next up is item 13, miscellaneous. Anybody have anything at all that they'd like to talk about tonight? Okay, well once again I want to thank everybody, especially everybody that participated in the Connecticut Bar Association training. That was a long Saturday of viewing. I think I was disappointed when we didn't get our ten minute break at
ten minutes to twelve to go out and grab a sandwich before we started right into the next presentation about all that stuff. That 10 that taxes your attention span just a little bit having that much at one time. But a lot of good stuff there. I thought it was well worth the time. There was just a lot of a good thing. Can And I ask you question? Yep, go ahead.
Kim, what throws up the red flag for pins, know, corner pins on people's properties? When do those get put into the property? When do we require them? Is there anything set that you know of? Yes. When the bids get set?
Subdivisions, they're required and they're placed on the as built plans.
Right? Who, I mean, who checks those PINs to make sure that they have been put in? Well, I check on the plan.
I know, but just because I've seen plans with it says that there's a PIN there, there's never a PIN there. I'm just curious. Does anybody ever go out and check?
I don't on a regular basis. I do if it's somebody that I'm not familiar with. I mean, I watch for is that the iron pins are proposed on the site plan and then on as builts, they should be shown as set. I mean, Freddie, the key. Alright. Is there a particular property or anything? I know it's an issue. I used to catch When an individual didn't, you know, they just weren't going in. They didn't realize it at first.
Jim, I don't recall that in Liteshka's acres back there, we had the pins on the drawing that we approved. And I know we talked about the fact that they would show up on the As Bill, But I know that's one of the things that I need to make sure I do a better job of is that we get all the monumentation put on the site plans when we approve them there.
Yeah, well, now that you mentioned it, I mean, the asphalt would not necessarily show all on a plot like that. It would show all the quarters. I can get a certification from the engineer.
Well, I reviewed, you know, in the subdivision regulations today, you know, as I was looking, trying to find that there's been fairly extensive marking of the boundaries with pins and monuments required every so many feet, you know, long lines and all that kind of stuff. So anyhow, I'll be looking for that on the as built drawing when we finally get one.
Yeah. But still, I think it's the same thing. It can say proposed or but it should say iron pin placed. Right. And somebody needs to go out and check it because I know that there's pins that have been on prints previously, and the LOSTeca one I know is not pinned.
Okay. I I will take a look at that. And I still have at least two two building permit to issue. I believe one one's been issued.
You're saying that I I see there's no there's no set schedule for that to happen. Maybe as part of the maybe as part of when the application comes in and the surveyor is out there. I don't I don't know if there needs to be a site lock and the the pin placement so we know that it's done. What do you think about that, Jed?
Well, I'm trying to find where it talks about that in the regs. When I looked this afternoon, what I read was the pins are required to be in before a building permit gets issued. I think so. So that would tell me that the building official, well, needs to go out there before a building permit to build a house is issued. We gotta go out and check the the bins are in. Right. So so at least that's in there. We know when when it's supposed to be done.
Yeah. I think probably the best road forward would be to include a standalone condition of approval on subdivisions that put the onus on the applicant, specifically the applicant's engineer or surveyor, to place them before a building permit's issued, and they can be verified at that time. But at least they're shown on a plan with a certification that they're there. Yeah. Maybe on
the permit, somebody's gonna have there's a checkbox or something that the PINs have been validated or something. Because I know of other things too, because I looked at something else this weekend and I found that it was a subdivision that we had just done in the last four or five years, I think, and there's no pin in that either. Yep. So they're just not getting done.
Yep. And and so our regulation states iron pins shall be installed at all lot corners. The commission shall require installation of such monuments and iron pins as a condition of approval of the subdivision or re subdivision. A building permit shall not be issued until required monumentation and corner pins are in place. So I don't know how you get a building permit, but part of getting a building permit should be to go out and check that the monuments and the pins are in place.
Whether that's Jim or that's the building official, I don't know who does that. Yeah. I wouldn't rely on the building official. I mean, they just don't do that. There are things the building official won't do.
That's one of them. Okay. Well, we ought to well, ought to be holding the right person accountable to do the job
that he needs Yeah, to and I guess that would be me. It's very difficult, to be honest, to amend our permit software. It gets extremely tricky to throw different requirements in there.
I don't know that it's tricky, Jim. We'll figure it out. I have talked to Eric about changing that software because there were a couple of things that I was unhappy with on the tracking. And Eric said, spend some of that money you got. Go out there and have somebody work on that project. If we need to budget for it next year, you know, I was specifically talking about problems with the wetlands not having any of the, the regulation requirements in the application anymore. But that applies to us as well. If not a tool that is helping us to get the stuff done that needs to be done, that's wrong because the paper copy that we used to use had all those checks on it. And then we went to the supercomputer version and all it does is have the guy's name and address on it. You know, it is essentially worthless as far as I'm concerned. Wow. So we'll take a look at that, but the process, I'm not keen on it, and I've been working first on my own process to make sure that the Planning and Zoning Commission does what we're supposed to do before I go out and tackle all these other things. There are still some holes out there and that's one of them. Jim will go out and take a look at it, Scott. Thank you, Jed and Jim. Any other miscellaneous topics?
I have one thing and I'll be quick. Just would like to add. I don't know if we have something in it already, but do we have anything that requires new construction or contractors to properly dispose of waste material from a site?
They're required to have a dumpster on-site during construction. That is a standalone. It's an ordinance within the town code of code of ordinances. Properly disposed of. Not that I'm aware of, no. I mean, if there's stray material left on-site.
Yeah. I mean, just I don't know about the majority of the projects going in town, but just speaking from personal experience, and I know it's done and over now at this point, but when they did 10 Webster, there's still trash that's blowing around in the woods that they, because they had a dump trailer and that was about it, and they were also burning a lot of their garbage on-site. So I just feel that that's something. Yeah, I did go out Townwide that we should really be, I mean, know, someone coming in and doing any sort of new construction in the town, they should at least be, you know, for disposing their own material properly. I agree with you. I agree with that, Kevin. I did Just go over
my 2¢. I just want to put that in there.
No, I appreciate you bringing that up, Kevin, because that's one of the things we struggle with about having a building official who is not in our building, if you will. He works from Coventry, Volt, whatever town he's normally in, and I think we're missing a linkage between him and Jim.
Know, I don't necessarily have the authority to, but I can. There's no reason I can't ask them to do it before I could pretend like I have the authority. Before we should It just
seems like right, you know, and right now they just don't really have any consequence because, you know, I know for ten Webster you went over and, you know, requested that they, you know, told them, I think at one point, that they needed to stop burning material and then, you leave, and then the next day, what do they do? They just go and start burning material again.
You have a burning official, but that individual does not monitor for the issue permits, that's it. It's a voluntary position, typically. But I was kind of surprised when I found that out. And I only found that out as a result of the 10 Webster during the course of somebody complained, and I wanted to, maybe it was you, and I thought I could defer it to the burning official, then I found out I couldn't.
Yeah, and I would imagine the burning official wouldn't issue permits for burning vinyl siding. No, we're done. Sounds like a burn pit.
You got it. Anyways, I don't want to hold it up. Just wanted No, to bring it I appreciate that. No, I appreciate your input. Can
just You need to be aware of those problems. Any other miscellaneous topics? Okay. I'll make a motion to adjourn, 856. Second. Second.
Okay, I think we got Steve in there or was that Scott? Scott, your box lit up. Must have been you seconding that. So Scott Person seconded. All in favor say aye. Aye. Aye.
Opposed? Hearing none, any abstain? Hearing none, motion passes five-zero-zero. Thank you very much. I didn't expect this meeting to go quite that long tonight, but there were some good things that we needed to hash through. I appreciate the support of all you guys, especially when it comes to doing the training and all that. We ask a lot of a bunch of volunteers. Appreciate it. So thank you very much. Everybody have a great evening. Steve, have a great trip down south. Thanks, Jed. Go pack.
Okay. Good night. Good night, everybody. Bye. Jed, good night.