Meeting transcript
Inland Wetlands and Watercourses Regular Meeting
September 13, 2022 · Watch on YouTube · All meetings
Call to order this regular meeting of the Andover Inland Wetlands and Water Courses Commission. I see on the call Commissioner Monroe and alternate Ed Smith present. Commissioner Larson previously indicated that he would not be able to attend tonight's meeting. Do we have any suggested changes or additions to the agenda? Seeing none, I'll go now to item four of our agenda, which is approval of the 08/01/2022 regular meeting minutes. Give you a moment to peruse the minutes and ask if there are any changes or additions. Mr. Monroe indicates none. I'm getting some feedback here. Anybody know where it's coming from? Would you like to try to sign in Okay,
yeah, I see Ed's getting an echo too. Me check my settings here. I'm. Mine went away, the echo. Yeah.
It's clear for me too now, but I did hear the I did hear it before.
Okay. Yeah, I heard it before, and it's good now on this end. So okay, well, I'm glad one of these problems disappear magically rather than having to call tech support. Okay, so I'll move to approve the minutes of the August one, twenty twenty two minutes and ask for a second. I'll second.
Okay, so motion and second. And again, with no additions or corrections, we're asking for the approval of the minutes. Let's see, are those in favor? Well, I guess we'll do a roll call. Commissioner Monroe? Aye. Commissioner Smith? Aye. Okay, and I also vote aye, so the motion carries three-zero-zero. Next, we have any opportunity for public comment, questions relevant to today's agenda. Again, seeing none, we will move then to new business, where we will take receipt and discuss any business before the Commission. We have I think all the public that's here has some business before the Commission, so we'll proceed immediately then to new business. Item 6A, application number 2,211 from the Andover Lake Management Association, which proposes to remove aquatic vegetation in the South Coast Of Andover Lake using a hydro rig. We have the application materials, of course, were posted online, and I see that we have oops, where'd he go? Oh, there he is. You just moved on the screen, Jeff. You're in the middle Okay, of the line. You're off the there you are. So, I'll ask Mr. Hayes to present the application here.
Yeah, so what we're looking at doing in recent years, you may have noticed that we've had lily pads that have expanded in The Cove from the they were in a small area on the what is that? The West Side Of South Cove. And now there are several patches that are expanding into the main cove itself. We would like to hydro rake those out, as well as we have some cattails that are growing now that have moved quite a ways out from shore in several places, and we would like to also remove those, using the hydro rake. The hydro rake is basically a dredge with a grappling hook on it that will pull these out, and, we have we'll be putting them into a dumpster and hauling them away.
Okay. Yeah, I know the application materials included some of what you just discussed shows a photograph of the hydro rake type equipment, which appears to be a vehicle on tracks with some gripper arms at the bow. I think it's actually a boat.
Think it's actually a boat. Okay, so it can float once it gets onto the water then. Yes. All terrain vehicle, I guess we could go. So any questions from commissioners about this application?
Chair Elliott, I do have a question about that. Yeah, go ahead, Commissioner Monroe. Jeff, with the if you're gonna be pulling all that stuff up, should you be making any kind of like a border to keep it in that cold area? Or is that just way out of?
Yeah, we asked the contractor about that and he said, especially where the cove is so shallow that you generally are not gonna have an issue with that getting into the lake. It's certainly not getting any amount of significant sediment into the lake because it's a quick process. It's, you know, one grab and gone, and it'll settle out pretty quickly. I will also say that we are, you know, we did the did the herbicide this year. We would prefer to use hydro raking, so this is a bit of a test case for us as well. We we don't really like the idea of putting herbicide in the lake. So if this works out successfully, we will probably consider additional applications for hydro waking in other areas of the lake to control some of the other weeds.
Okay. Commissioner Smith, did you have any questions regarding this application?
No. I'm good. I just removed a bunch of cattails from my little vernal pool, so I totally understand Jeff's situation. Okay, yep.
Okay, well, does bring me to the question of just really why are we anxious to remove cattails and water lilies? She said, is Alma?
Yeah, because they're taking over the cove. If we allow this to continue, our cove will be a water lily pond, and the cattails have moved substantially out from shore. There's one area where they've probably come 20 feet out from where they were five years ago. So the concern is we want to maintain the lake. We want to make sure that, you know, as these things happen, kind we of maintain the shoreline that we have now.
Okay, so maintaining the shoreline is the key here. I wondered if there had been, you know, complaints or concerns raised by homeowners along the cove, or concerns actually brought this?
There have. Yeah, there have been. I mean, I'm one of the homeowners. Some of the cattails are in front of my house, but there have been others also that have complained that, you know, Nada, I don't know if you know Nada or seen us. Her shoreline is, almost all cattails now. But yeah, it's really just a question of trying to maintain what we have. We want to keep the cove viable. You know, that's a good catch for, things that flow into the lake through that river. So we don't want to lose the cove. We don't want it to fill in because that stuff will all flow into the lake then, and we won't have the sediment trap that we have now in the cove.
I should think that actually cocktails would make a better sediment trap, but that's not a hinder there. We have Yeah.
Okay. One other question. Yes. I'm sure this has been talked about. I just haven't been in the conversation. I mean, you thinking that maybe you should consider dredging that area?
Well, that's kind of what this is. We don't want to bring a dredge in because then you have a you have a lot of, material that you have to get rid of, and that's a pretty disruptive process. This is more like a set of a grappling hook that that does have a also has a suction on it. So I mean, would we like to dredge the cove? You know, that would take some study to see whether or not that would would be good. But this is something that's done pretty regularly to eradicate some of these weeds. Thank you.
Okay, well, any other questions or comments regarding the application? Oh, and the other thing was when contemplate would having the work conducted?
We want to do it just before we draw it down for the winter. So we'd like to do it in October. That's why we're in here this week, this month. I understand you guys don't approve the same month that we wouldn't get an approval until the October meeting. Is that Yes. Yeah. So that's our timing is that we want to get it done this fall, and that'll give it the winter, obviously, to settle out as well.
Okay. Well, as you noted, we are simply considering or we're receiving application and discussing it at this meeting. We won't be able to act on it until October. So, guess if, again, any other questions or comments? And if not, I will thank you, Jeff, for your contribution or for presenting this, and we can then move on to our next item on the agenda. Okay, thank you as well. Welcome.
Okay, next item on the agenda being an application number 20 by Mark Reynolds, an engineer on behalf of Judy Connolly, the property owner, who I believe is on the call. And, it's for, basically driveway, crossing a wetlands, for a single family residence at what will be, well, it's Lot 22 On Lake Road. Who's going to, Oh, I should also note that this is an application that's, as it were, revived. It had been approved in 2005, but was, of course, a five year term limit. So, it's a new application for our purposes. However, we have some history on it in terms of the approval and the conditions that were attached to that approval. So, who is going to present the application or present the proposed project?
I'd be happy to do that, and I appreciate the background there. Is it possible I can share my screen? Would that please the Commission? I could run through a couple of slides. Think it would be helpful. I think our
our agent is in charge of the meeting, he's got the administrator privileges.
It should be set up so you can share it now, I think. Yeah, I think it is. So I'll start that now.
Okay, so can everyone hear me and see my screen? Yep. Okay, excellent. So this is just an overall to get you dialed in as to where we are. The proposed activity is on the lot that's inside the green circle here on the east side of the lake. This is a snippet of the aerial photo from the GIS system. Just gives you an indication of the property. It's a wooded parcel. It's between 411 And 407 Lake Road. You can see there's a house here on this side and one right here. These two houses follow largely the same configuration that we'll be proposing. Again, the mostly wooded, the topography is from high in the North to low in the South. So the surface drainage is from a northerly to a southerly direction here, and you can see Lake Road along the bottom. So here is the proposed plan. And as George mentioned, there was a plan that was approved in 2005. This plan is substantially the same as that. The wetland area is depicted here in yellow. It's depicted based on the same delineation as that original application.
We've walked the site, we have no reason to think that there would be any significant change in the wetland boundary. The yellow line here is the 100 foot buffer. I'm showing the driveway in the house here, and then we've located the septic to the rear of the property, which is the furthest away from the wetland areas and would be would occur based on a pump, a pump system because that's upgrading. So on this site plan, the highest areas here, and then then it drains towards the wetlands. Get a little closer on the site here and give some more detail for everybody and kind of let you know some of the features. So as I mentioned, the driveway crossing the wetlands would necessitate culvert pipe. So we're proposing a 15 inches culvert pipe right in this location, and I'll zoom in it, zoom into it in a little bit. The house is here, the septic is furthest up in the back. We'll also be proposing, as is the requirement of the zoning regulation for nutrient allocation, a rain garden in this front area of the property. The type of rain garden that I would propose would be not an excavated area, but rather a berm area to catch runoff. It'll kind of fit with the natural grade here because you notice the topography in this direction. So the driveway and the roof leaders can be caught in this area to meet the requirements that 7.6
in the zoning regulations for nutrient man nutrient allocation. So erosion sediment controls, I'm showing dash yellow lines where silt fence are proposed, some around the work area, and then of course, along the sides of the driveway, you know, from the start of the buffer all the way out to the street. In terms of some numbers here, we're estimating about 1,000 square feet of area of wetlands that would be disturbed. That's approximately from the wetland line to the line is about 50 feet and with about an average of 20 feet. It'll be a little wider at the culvert, a little skinnier over in this area to create the culvert, the driveway, and the little bit of fill that goes with it.
Upland review area is in the order of like 2,500 square feet, and that's really just the extension of the driveways in this area, and in this area. So
we have a standard erosion sediment control plan on the second sheet of the plan, along with our septic design notes, silt fence, and E and S sequence in notes. This is the zoomed in on the area of the culvert pipe. You can see we'll have a rock apron on either side of it for erosion protection, then a self fence, you know, to protect the wetlands during construction. That's the extent of it there. And so I think I'll leave the slide up here if anyone has any questions. We did, obviously, whenever we're going to have an impact to a wetland, we look at alternatives. There simply aren't any on this site. The wetland separates the buildable portion of the parcel from the street. As you can see, there's only just a small area of property in the front that's all within the front. The 50 foot front yard setback. The lot, know, is an existing lot. We're not proposing this is not a subdivision. We're not proposing this large. It's there. It's the way it's the only feasible way that I can see to develop the property for a single family residence.
Be happy to answer any questions if you have them. Okay, any questions from commissioners? Mr. Munro?
I have a question. Just curious, is the symbol that overlays the driveway where it contacts Lake Road, does that mean permeable surface?
Nope, that's our symbol for the temporary construction entrance pad. So that's detailed on the second sheet. And what that is, is an area of two inch crushed stone that's placed down during construction to prevent the tracking of sediments onto the street and surrounding area. Thank you. Yep. Okay. Commissioner Monroe again, did you have any?
I do have a question. I don't know if I know how to ask it. That wetlands there, that, it seems like is that like a is it just end right here on the south side and does it end right there on the north side or does it keep going?
I can understand your question because of the drafting here. The on the north side right up here, I understand that to be the northern extent of this particular wetland. There are there are other wetland systems in the surrounding area, but I understand that to be the extent of it because as you move north from there, the grade goes up. But as you move south from here, it's not the case. I'm gonna just jump back a couple slides. So you can see here, as you move south, this is down gradient. So I expect that historically the wetland extended through this area, but, you know, also there's a driveway crossing here. So I think that the that, you know, this line, let me go back one more. This line segment between WF 9 And 10 is unfortunate drafting at this point. I don't have any assurance that this doesn't extend further to the south, although just south of here, you'll find the driveway to 407 Lake Road. Okay, right.
Okay, I had a couple of questions regarding the application. Seems to me that, okay, in the application it states that there are no water courses on the site, and that there would therefore be no water course impact. Yet, the photographs that were submitted by the agent, especially the ones from January of this year, showed pretty clearly that there's a seasonal water course on the property. Now, I'm not exactly sure where that is in relation to the driveway and the culvert, but I suspect that the culvert might be designed to capture that seasonal runoff and keep it from overflowing, said driveway.
Okay. Yeah, that may be the case. I think the application was an attempt to best characterize the activity. There's 1,000 square feet of disturbance in here. If the it a part of that 1,000 square feet of disturbance may very well be a what twenty four twenty five foot section of an intermittent water course. I I'm not I think I'm satisfied with that characterization. The way you just described it. It doesn't change the fact that there's a drainage area of about eight acres that's up gradient of the driveway at this point, which this collects. And that's the purpose of the culvert as a release to that area. I think it's perhaps a intermittent watercourse, but I understood the application to be the application form to be like in a case where there's like a, a not a seasonal watercourse, but a, but a like a permanent watercourse like a brook. But I mean, we can we could be. We'd happy to amend our application in any way that you'd feel like it would be more appropriate. I don't have it right in front of me, so I apologize.
That's okay. I encourage you to work with our wetlands agent on that. I'm just raising the question because, as I say, from a statutory perspective, a water course is a water course, So there's that. The other thing is that I didn't see anything on the two pages of site plan that we were provided with the application that were posted online, you had detail for such things as sediment control and septic system. But again, no engineering details for the culvert per se. And since that's what we're particularly looking at approving here, we would certainly like to see that addressed in the application supporting documents.
Understood. That may have been an oversight on our part, but I'm the design engineer, and our intent is to have at least a 10 by 10 apron of rock apron on either side of the culvert and flared ends on either side. So it would follow the BMP for outlet protection as it's listed in the DEP's manual. And otherwise, besides that, this is basically a low head culvert, meaning, you know, we're only gonna have a couple feet, the minimum amount of fill over the culvert. But we'll be happy to provide an update with detail for that.
Okay, good. Okay, and finally, again, the notes include that the driveway corridor through the wetlands is to have removal of invasive species and planting of natives such as highbush blueberry and other wetland adapted species, which of course I want to encourage, and I would encourage too, as it were mitigation, to see if the removal of invasives could be extended, perhaps further into the water, of course. I couldn't tell from the photographs, and I haven't been at that site in a long time, but my suspicion would be that there's Barberry and Bittersweet and maybe a few others on that property. And this is more of a personal point of view than a regulatory one, but any efforts to remove and to eradicate those woody invasives is strongly encouraged.
Yeah, I can appreciate that. I deal with that at my place constantly, so I know where you're coming from. You can throw Japanese knotweed in there too. Oh God. Get out the Triazine or the I Posture just call it exercise. Just keep stopping.
But no, well, I think every every every effort can be made and I'll I'll review. I'll view that with the owner and you know, and make sure that your message is conveyed.
Okay, thank you. Okay, that's the extent of the questions that I had. And again, I'll ask if there are any other questions or comments from the commissioners or, again, Agent Wagner, obviously you've seen the site a couple of times based on the photographic evidence.
Yeah. I mean, it seems it was very different. Like you said, there was actually, like, almost a water course, and you could kinda when I came went there last week to take the pictures For the meeting, it was, you know, it's quite a bit different. You could kind of see where. The water would run down through there. There's like barely on stage two drought, so yeah, yeah, I went right after the rainstorm, hoping there would be a little more water, but it still wasn't, so it's probably all brown water coming out of that hill and. Yeah, the the stream channel really wasn't very well defined. But you could kind of make out where it was. It wasn't, you know, just a. Depression, but it's basically flat in that area.
Well, that answers my question too about the the water course. It's kind of an ill defined water course, as it were, seasonal runoff more than a water course per se. If there's no clear channel, then it wouldn't qualify. Okay, let me look over at my notes here. Okay, that's really it as far as I'm concerned. Again, if there are any other questions or comments from the commissioners, I do appreciate the presentation, and I like the graphics. Again, if you could submit those to our agent as part of the application. I think it would be well received to supplement the formal plan that was attached to the application that was posted online.
Happy to do that. Good.
Good. Okay. Well, if there are no further questions or comments, we'll obviously hold off on any further consideration of the application until our October meeting, at which time we should be able to make a vote on approval for that application.
I appreciate it. Thanks for your time. Okay, and thank you. All right.
Okay. So, moving on, got to get back to the agenda. Okay, yeah, item seven. We've got some agent report items to consider. So, Agent Wagner, take it away. I had
a two upland review area approval this month. One was a was 57 Hendy Road. It was it's a two car metal garage, so they're excavating out a little bit, putting a concrete pad down and then putting a metal garage up. It's within the 200 foot upland review area of Skunkumug River. It's pretty far away. It's a 140 feet, so it's in between Hendy Road and the house. So it didn't seem like it would have much of an impact. It's currently in. In zoning right now because it's a. It's a flood insurance floodplain, so it might it might may or may not get billed right now. So then the second one is 369 Lake Road. It's a it was a, yeah, a 1,000 gallon crack. The septic tank had a crack top, so they replaced it with a thousand gallon plastic one. And all those plans are available on the website for viewing if you need to. It was, a one day project that they came in and that. And then the last thing was the Andover Auto Parts property.
Mister Hank Bruner had pointed out a vernal pool that had some tires and wheels in it that was back there. And they had some parts tags from Andover Auto Parts. So I had sent mister Genovese, the owner of Andover Auto Parts, a letter, asking him to remove them. I'm not sure who put them in there. I'm guessing maybe some some kids went in and took them to the top of the hill and rolled them down, or I don't know. It seemed like the auto parts store would store wheels in a in a vernal pool. But, yeah, he went and, cleaned them up. So he said, I haven't been out there to check, but, he had sent me a letter saying it was cleaned up.
Okay. There are a couple of items that were hanging from, last month about the, well, of course, Jed isn't here, so maybe Moot, but he had asked about, some work at 196 Lake Road and also wanted to, see if there's any further follow-up on the work at, 25 Sidermill Road. Last meeting you'd indicated that they were going to begin work on that project that involved crossing Staddle Brook, and I wonder if that had, you know, if they commenced on that.
Yeah, I drove by and, I didn't see anything, but the really, I mean, the work was all in back in the house and all. He was gonna do all the contractor was gonna do is drive through the brook with his excavator.
Right. Were they weren't they gonna put down some kind of temporary bridging material?
Yeah. He that's what we were talking about last month. He had called and asked about it, and the water was low enough. He was like, we could just drive over if we put some, you know, blocks on the sides of the bank to protect the bank and then just drive over the rocks. And then so, know, we looked at it. There's hardly any water flowing. Yeah. Don't So it
seemed like it would be a good a good alternative. It's probably even less invasive than putting a bunch of boards in the in the, in the river.
Yeah, the timber putting the timbers down would dislodge the rocks and sediment and all that anyhow. Okay. And then there was something about a nutrient allocation. But again, since that's Yeah. That was I think Jim is still
working on that now. I asked him for a report last week, and I think he's still trying to figure that out. I think they were just gonna do some dry wells, so run the roof drains into dry wells, and I think that would take care of their nutrient load reduction. Okay,
good, good. Okay, well, on then. In our other business, commission vacancies, we still have them. I did contact former Commissioner Megan Lally, and she indicated that basically the, you know, the conditions that had led her to resign from the Commission in the first place, this Zoom meetings, were still a concern. I guess there are, well, first of all, there are issues with doing it from home with kids, and secondly, eye strain from being on the screen all the time. But she did indicate that should the Commission in the future decide to resume in person meetings, she would consider rejoining. And since she was a valuable member and even served as chairman for a point, I think that that's something worth noting and keeping in mind for the future. Otherwise, I'm not aware of any bites or indication of interest from anyone who's looking to join our effort. That brings us to okay, I'll ask if anybody else has any bright ideas for recruitment. Just let me know and see what we can do. That brings us then to item 8b.
There's an ongoing effort, and Hank Gruner is here to talk about a proposal to, well, basically an application for funding to purchase what is known as the Ladano property. Hank, if you could take it away.
Sure. Joe, do I have the ability to share screen?
Yeah, it should be. Yeah. It should be set for you to share. Okay. Hold on.
Let me see if I can call something up for you folks. Let's see. And thank you for adding me to the agenda for tonight's meeting. Hopefully this will go on. It's spinning. I'm getting a, not liking the process. Now, here we go. If folks see that.
Hasn't come up on oh there is not coming up. Frank has started screen sharing. There we go alright,
so let me everybody sees it. Yep. Right, let me just get the right slide I want Okay, so the the town is. I don't know if folks are familiar, but the Department of Environmental Protection generally each year has funding to support acquisition of properties through a cost sharing program with municipalities. It's called the the open space and watershed land acquisition program and this year there are, think, 5,000,000 in the funds and I think there's another 5,000,000 in 2023. And they launched that application process few months back inviting municipalities to submit for properties that they're interested in on the Conservation Commission had recommended to planning and zoning oh several months back now. Michael The potential acquisition of what's known as the Ladano property, which is 162 acre piece of undeveloped land that sits between Boston Hill Road and Shotty Mill Road. Michael it's basically almost diagonally across from the transfer station, so I have it outlined on that worth you know the aerial image there, you can see Shotty Mill Road up to the top, and you can see Boston Hill Road is sort of down to the bottom bottom area. The reason we selected that was because it is in our one of our open space corridors in town, which are the priority areas for open space acquisition and for conservation easements and conservation work based on our 2015 plan of conservation and development, where an analysis was done to look at you know, the areas where, know, based on natural resources, recreational potential, agriculture, and so forth, what are the best areas in town that really support that? This is in the area called the Western Highlands Open Space Corridor,
and it's a fairly large corridor that includes you can see it there on the the the. The lower side it includes Bishop Chabonk Wildlife Management Area down to the southern end. All the way up to the large town owned parcel to the north. There is the 80 plus acres of town owned land that abuts the transfer station and connects to the Hop River State Park Trail. In between that, the light green is the Ladano parcel I just mentioned, and then just to the west of that is an additional 38 acres of town open space where you may recall, we acquired, I believe, a year ago that was donated from the Northern Connecticut Land Trust, as well as a private landowner Thomas Talbot, who donated 17 acres, I believe. Then there's a town holding. There was already an existing town holding there. And Tom Talbot, the landowner who donated previously, also has a four acre in holding that he's willing to donate. That's the lower little square you see cut into the lower green that he's willing to donate as part of this initiative. So it's an area that based on its natural resource values, it has core forest and as I'll show you some significant wetland connections. We made the recommendation that the town should pursue purchasing as it is on the market. This will give you an idea of the wetland connections, if you take a look at the the dots you may remember from my verbal pool presentation,
those are all the locations of vernal pools, there are 15 of them located in that 162 acre parcel and to give you a sense of. How unique that density is if you think of the seven twenty acres seven twenty three acre Bishop Swamp Wildlife Management Area that has nine to 10 vernal pools. You think of the the five ten acre at least that's the amount of acres in Andover of Nathan Hale State Forest that has nine to 10 vernal pools this 162 acres has 15. In addition, if you look at the the other colored swaths there, they are poorly or very poorly drained wetland soils is the light purple. And then, where it overlaps green you get this blue coloration or green coloration which are basically freshwater forest shrub wetland systems based on the national wetland inventory map. So it's fairly wetland rich. There's a, as you can see, there's also a watercourse on the eastern side there that connects that that wetland system. And then of course on the western side, outside of the boundary of the parcel is the Burnout Brook system, which is a high quality cold water stream that's recognized by the DEP. This parcel falls within that watershed, so the buffering capacity of 162 acres of forested land is provides significant value for protecting that cold water stream habitat, especially giving
given that vertical pools and cold water streams are two of the habitat types that are considered extremely vulnerable to changing climatic conditions. So for a lot of those reasons we've recommended that we pursue this we've gone through the process of working with planning and zoning. We went through board of selectmen last week and they approved using open space funds in the town for the purchase, along with matching from the state. They also approved our submission of an application to the state, is due on September 30. And they approved us entering negotiations with the realtor for the prop for the parcel. Which we may have by the end of today have made an already have made an offer on the the parcel with several contingencies. One being that we obviously would successfully have a grant award from the state, and the other that we would successfully pass a town vote for acquisition of the parcel, would occur later in the process. So what what we're requesting from the Inland Wetlands Commission is as part of the application, we want to the state obviously is interested in how strong the application or the parcel conforms to the states to the town's plan of conservation development. But also they're looking, you know, do you have support from your your key agencies in your town and boards in your town, which include planning and zoning conservation commissions and then the wetland commissions. Commissions. Planning and zoning already has a support letter conservation Commission is working on one and we're requesting a support letter from the Inland Wetlands Commission that we would be able to include with the application To the to the state.
That's that's kind of where we are on it on the on the project I'm writing the grant proposal I'm pretty much complete with most of the narrative with the narrative and just finished up the maps today you're actually looking at some of the maps that will go in with the be inserted into the application. And we're now compiling. Support letters and then going through an internal review process with town administrator and planning and zoning folks to, know, to just, you know, make that the proposal, make sure we've dotted all the eyes and we have all the pieces from the checklist
gearing up for September 30 submission to the program. It's highly competitive. We don't know what our chances are. It depends obviously on the other applications that come in and the parcels that they're looking at. Just to give you a sense of it, town, the the state will pay up to 65% of the appraised value of the property. We're asking for 56% of the appraised value and using the remainder of that would be covered through town open space fund, which would not use up all of our town open space fund. So that would leave us, I think, about $18,000 remaining in the open space fund. So that's kind of where we are in the process, and I guess I'll answer any questions that folks might have about the parcel or the process.
Okay. Well, I walked that parcel many, many years ago as a member of the Conservation Commission, and when the town, first electman, was trying to spearhead negotiations to acquire the property. Unfortunately, that all fell through, so here we are back again. This time, however, I think we have a better chance in terms of, first of all, the possibility of state support, and secondly, the existence of a dedicated town open space fund, so that, you know, there's money that doesn't affect your mill rate. And I agree that it's a high value area for conservation. I guess my question would be what restrictions on use would be entailed in this application or in acquiring the property. You know, we have some history of Tano land and might want to avert, say, as I mentioned earlier, clear cut logging or, you know, motor vehicle dirt bike trails, things like that.
So, couple of things to that, and that's a good question, Chairman. One is that, part of my response to it is that if we were to accept, if the program was awarded for state funding, we that limits what we can do with that parcel because that they're limited to basically passive outdoor recreation, and they have a whole list of what entails passive outdoor recreation. So basically, that is, you know, it's hiking, it's snowshoeing, it's, you know, it's any of the activities that do not really require the placement of infrastructure in there. So for example, we wouldn't want to be going and paving a road in there for for, you know, paved trails, or we we wouldn't want to be putting big pavilions in there or big structures in there. That would be a problem. We can put hiking trails, and we are recommending our goal of this is primarily as a conservation area, which would be managed more for its ecological potential, but would also serve passive outdoor recreation. So there's an existing cart path that runs through the center of the parcel right up the center. It's about a mile long, and then we're envisioning the possibility of putting additional side spur trails through there. There already are some logging the parcels been logged several times in the past,
so there are some old logging roads through there. Although we're going very, very carefully about our proposal for that. We're not recommending a particular route to that we're recommending that that would be a phased in process, we would work with joshua's trust who's agreed to sort of serve an advisory capacity with us. Because we don't want to get into a situation where we create trails that either impact the impact the ecological integrity of the parcel, especially since there's a lot of wetlands or that entail more maintenance than we really can deal with. We don't want to get into that. But we do envision put it, you know, that it will be accessible by the public for passive recreational use. We would have to put in a parking area. There's good access. There's about 1,300 feet of access or frontage along Shottie Mill Road, and there's an existing gate there where they would go in for the logging, and there's sort of an open herbaceous shrub covered area. It's ideal for it's dry, and it's ideal spot for creating an unimproved parking area that could fit, say, five to six cars. So that we would need to put in along with some signage noting noting that this was a public accessible conservation area. Our vision on this is actually to create a two zero four acre conservation area that would be the 162 acre parcel, the town owned 38 acres, the four acres of Talbot will donate.
That whole two zero four acre piece would become the Monument Hill because it's centered on Monument Hill, Monument Hill Conservation Area. So it'd be sort of the first dedicated conservation area in town. So that's kind of how we positioned it, you know, it really will be primarily used as an act, you know, for ecological purposes. We are not precluding forestry, although we're stating that forestry would be associated with management for ecological purposes, not for timber harvest. And the same for potential hunting, for example, deer hunting. The only time that that would be considered would be for management considerations if it was determined that the, you know, the deer abundance in the in the parcel was such that it was affecting the forest health of the parcel. You might have recalled well, you might not have. I mean, think we sent that to Board of Selectmen. The Conservation Commission weighed in on that with other parcels in the town. In a similar way, we looked at the health of the forests in the town owned parcels and made a recommendation that at this time you know they're fairly healthy and didn't really need deer hunting in it, but but left open the door that you know that's something that may need to be considered down the road
for ecological health of some of those some of those systems so that's kind of how we're handling it it's very similar to. The town owned spaces that we 38 acres we actually commissioned. The environmental review team to do a review of that when we were considering accepting those parcels. And they had similar findings to what we're recommending with the Ladano parcel when they did their report for the same reasons. I mean, you know, that's pretty much it's contiguous habitat, so the characteristics are very similar to the Ladano parcel, only writ large. So we're following pretty much those same recommendations from that ERT review that says this really supports conservation based on the forest quality here and the wetland quality and really minimal outdoor recreational use and not not a not a heavy hand in forestry or or other applications. So that's kind of our approach as setting it up as a conservation area.
Okay, well, other Commissioners want to weigh in on this comments or questions?
Commissioner Monroe. Yeah. I I I think I know where that place is that you are talking about. If you are going up Shawty Mill Road on the right hand side, you will see a gate there. Yes, almost when you well. No, Burnap Brook Road.
Is it all this is? Yeah, this is on Shotty Mill. If you were at the if you were at the transfer station. Yeah, so you're coming out of the transfer station. If you took a right, it's just up the road on the left. You'll see a green gate, little pull out and a green gate. Oh, that's the it's that property and it stretches almost to Boston Hill Road.
Oh, Okay. No, that's a different place than I would I thought I was. I was thinking this was closer to Bolton.
It does border. If you look, can see on the western side, it literally follows the Bolton line. This is actually an area where we did some boundary marking of the of the town property. Does butt right up against Bolton up on its northwestern corner there. Okay. It's not.
Go ahead. I'm sorry. Yeah, I've never been there, so I'd be very interested in going there someday. Beautiful property, actually. Let's buy it.
Try to see if it was another map that might give you a better indication of this one, let's see. That's good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. See, there's the, yeah, but you don't see that doesn't really have the roads on it as well. Here, maybe the topo map might be better. So there's Monument Hill. You can see Boston Hill Road on the bottom there. Shotty Mill up top. Whales Road over there on the right sort of see how it's positioned. Oh yeah.
And that's Bolton, that little box there, 90 degree angle, that's Bolton where you see Shotty, the word Shotty. Yeah. Shotty Mill Roof, that's Bolton. And there's the Burnett Brook system. You can see the Burnett Brook system, so there's that large wetland that used to be, I think, wasn't that Shotty Shotty Mill Pond historically? Wasn't that the area that was ponded for the old blacksmith mill there?
I wouldn't know, but seems plausible, obviously, that that large of a wetland area. Yeah. And there is, there is, as you pointed out, Little Shawty Mill Road intersects. There is town owned property behind the transfer station, which goes down along Burnt Brook toward and ends at the rail trail. Again, when I was on Conservation Commission, we examined that and looked at that for, again, possibility for passive recreation. And I noted on the map that you showed us earlier, there's some thought about having a trail system
that would Yeah, okay, trail Actually, yeah, that's exactly right, George, is, you know, one of the one of the opportunities, and this isn't part I mean, we're showing them potential long range plans here. The green line there you see that's the Hop River State Park Trail over there on the far right that whole sort of. Tan ish colored parcels 80 some acres of town land. Which really doesn't have a lot of wetlands on it, it has the one little sort of watercourse. But that's a butts the Hop River State Park Trail so there's an opportunity to connect a hiking or biking trail that could connect to the parking area, the proposed parking area for the new conservation area. There would not be biking allowed in the conservation area. So that's something that we're sort of looking at is do we want to shuttle people there? We would provide a bike rack in the parking area because they would not be allowed to bike in the conservation area. Okay.
Commissioner Smith, did you have any questions or comments regarding the proposal?
That was an excellent presentation, and it makes all sense to go forward with that proposal that Hank gave. Thank you. Okay.
Then I guess that what we should do here is to, well, I will make a motion to express the support of the IWWC for this acquisition, and that would then, of course, lead to drafting a letter of support, which I could provide to Hank Gruner for attachment to the proposal, especially if he can provide me with a work example. So, again, I will make the formal motion to express the support of Inland Wetlands Water Courses Commission for this acquisition. Can I have a second? I'll second that. Okay, so moved and seconded to express support for the proposal. Any discussion? Okay, seeing none, I'll take a vote. Commissioner Monroe? Aye. Commissioner Smith? Aye.
And I also vote aye, so the motion carries three-zero-zero, and we will, as I say, or I will draft a letter of support to convey to Conservation Commission. Thank you all for your time. You're welcome, and I'll be in touch Good, with you, good. And thanks for your effort in, you know, really organizing and moving this thing forward. This, I'm sure, can have a lot better chance of success
based on your efforts. Well, it's been a team effort with, you know, we've had some great support from, the folks at Planning and Zoning and from Eric Anderson, the town administrator, so there's been a team effort to move it forward. Hopefully we'll. It'll be a positive outcome. Okay, or we can, you know, if it doesn't sell, we can always go back next year and try again, suppose.
That's the way it goes with grants. Know that. That's exactly right. Okay, well, thanks again, and we'll move on now to item 8c. We still have, okay, so we're still looking at Old Farms Road.
Yeah. That was something that, I remember Jed with the Planning and Zoning Commission, they had talked about having us discuss it at the next meeting, So I added it to the agenda. Of course, our, planning and zoning representative isn't here tonight. But, basically, I talked to George Korea about, I guess, when they originally got the permit approval, Eversource, they were gonna put utility lines from Pine Ridge Drive, and they're gonna put some more from Old Farms. And then. When let's see. Trying to think of what yeah. So it's coming through the wetlands crossing on Pine Ridge Drive, and then one will split over to that property. And then another one was supposed to come from Old Farm
and go down to that property. But I guess Eversource wanted them to put them all together and have, like, one connection from the road. So they decided to go all from Pine Ridge Drive through the wetlands crossing and then continue up into the, you know, through the woods and into the other Property. So basically, for us, it's the same because there's already there was already utilities going through that wetlands crossing. Yeah, right. We we approved that plan with and then where it splits off there. That's outside the Oakland review area. Yeah, so basically we really don't have much of a. There really shouldn't be any change in our plan because it all moves through unregulated
area. Right. It would be a net gain anyhow because wasn't there an issue with wetlands along or approximate to the driveway from Times Farm Road, if I recall the.
Yeah. There is stuff. Yeah. There's some some water on that side. Yeah. So there would be less less impact over there, of course.
Okay. Well, it's basically just a heads up, and we don't really have to take any action, and we'll see if there's any, you know, if Planning and Zoom really wants our input on that. I think we can provide it pretty readily.
Yeah, yeah. I had a question for Joe, Chair Elliott. Yeah, go ahead or comment more than a question. It was my understanding that they they actually built the the bridge over the wetlands.
Yeah, it's in. It's in progress. It's in place. I have some pictures here. I've been keeping an eye on there. I go there, like, once a week or so to see what what he's been doing now. So, basically, everything's finished from Pine Ridge down to the wetlands crossing and then across the crossing, and then now he's he's working on the other end going up the hill. So the the concrete culvert's all in place, The drainage, the riprap channel, you know, erosion control mat is on the side of the the hill. It's all graded. Yeah. It's looking clicking right, man. It's been really dry, so not a great time to do it.
We we'd be interested in seeing some of those photos. I'd I'd kind of be interested just to see. What it is, you know what?
After all that discussion, what we came up with, to be honest with you. Yeah, that would good. Why include that on the agenda for our next meeting when you're with your report, you give us a little update on that. Okay, yeah. Okay. Anything else to come before the commission? We're at the end of our agenda. Our next regular meeting will be on Monday, October 3 at 7PM, same time, same place. Agenda to be distributed. Obviously, we've got a couple of items that we will need to vote on, really. We'll have the applications that we received today to deal with. Nothing else pending I could see online, so we'll see what we see. Okay, and with that,
I will say that with no objection, I will declare the meeting adjourned. No objection. And Ed, who's not able to get his video to work, I can see him saying goodbye nevertheless. Thank you, George and everybody. Thanks, George.
Yeah, thanks for being here. Good Good night all, and you can press the little red leave button. Good night.